Linux Users

[KiBa]

The latest Unity is a big improvement. No fundamental change jumps out, but a series of little tweaks have improved it, and I can see now that it can be made into something very good. Maybe by 11.10 it will reach maturity.

[Dorian]

Of course it can be made into something good (I won't go as far as to say "very good). But just like you said, it will be no sooner than in 11.10. That's why I won't even bother with 11.04.

[KiBa]

lol, I say "very" good because I can't stand Gnome3 Gnome Shell at all, and there's just something about KDE, even at 4.6, that irks me.

[R3N]

Well I am waiting for Linux mint version of Gnome3. They will modify it to be productive the way we like it .
Gnome 3 is targeted towards normal users who only use a computer for facebook,watching videos you know social media crap & web 2.0 stuff... It is not targeted for advanced users like most linux users...
I think is just dumb move they going after normal people and ignoring the advanced geek users.. I read you can't even right click?.
Anyway the current ubuntu version that has unity is beta version.
Who knows maybe they might drop unity? or make it better.
I have not even bother to use unity.
I am very happy with my current version it works, is fast,secure, and very productive.
I love workspaces,tomboy notes,mint taskbars, my timmer applet etc
I just love Mint which is more windows like. Ubuntu well is just a Mac OS like right now

[Dorian]

They won't drop Unity, not for 11.04. ;/

[R3N]

Anyone have try Mint 11?
I am downloading it right now.
It has the classic Gnome we like. No unity or Gnome 3.
It suppose to use less resourses and look nicer than mint 10.

[KiBa]

Aye. I just wonder what will happen come Mint 12, when the Ubuntu base switches to Gnome 3.

I use KDE now, myself. I have come to like it. I can be tweaked into useful simplicity. I will miss Gnome2's design, but I do prefer QT apps. Hopefully, when Ubuntu moves closer to QT, new elegant shells will be made for those that still want something like the Gnome2 design.

[Dorian]

I use KDE now, myself. I have come to like it. I can be tweaked into useful simplicity. I will miss Gnome2's design, but I do prefer QT apps. Hopefully, when Ubuntu moves closer to QT, new elegant shells will be made for those that still want something like the Gnome2 design.

[R3N]

I tried mint 11 it looks almost the same as mint 10.I notice I can make panels smaller which I liked.
Also I can use libre office. I try so hard to use libre on mint 10 but it never worked for me.
It has new tools but is it basically the same.
What is so good about QT apps? I have a KDE version but never used it much. I would like to know what QT apps are are they like gnome applets?

[KiBa]

Qt (pronounced "cute", btw) is just a application framework made by Nokia for developing software and user interfaces. It's not KDE specific. It just happens that KDE is made with Qt, as is Google Earth, Photoshop, VLC Media Player, and lots of other software, but Qt apps can be run in Gnome too. It's completely cross-platform, so KDE apps can be run in Mac and Windows natively. Ubuntu uses GNOME by default, and GNOME is written in GTK+. The current Ubuntu, and all previous versions, used GTK+2. Now, with GNOME3, coming in Ubuntu 11.10, they are at version GTK+3.

Qt is very easy to develop for. GTK+2 is more complicated. GTK+3 aims to improve GTK+. I have always preferred a lot of Qt apps to equivalent GTK+2 apps. I like stuff like Marble and Amarok in the KDE apps suite a lot. Marble in particular is just a great program. You should check it out if you haven't already. It's a small consideration, admittedly, but the default KDE games are also, in my opinion, superior to the Gnome games. In general, Qt is more advanced and the apps are much better looking than GTK+2 apps. Qt strives to use native widgets in every environment, so it looks less out of place than GTK apps under Mac, for example. Since Qt are also easier to make, they are very popular. As such, it will be compatible with Wayland when it replaces X. Of course, Qt is licensed under GNU LGPL.

Up until even a year ago, it was said that Qt apps use more memory and there are less of them than GTK+ apps, therefore GTK+ is better. The memory problem has been resolved, and Mark Shuttleworth is an admirer of Qt apps and plans to ship Ubuntu with Qt (not KDE) from now on. Unity2d is Qt. Thus, Qt apps can be default in Ubuntu from 11.10 on. At that point, there will be no distinction but the quality of apps made with each framework, and my guess is that there will be a lot more Qt apps, since they'll have a shot at being included in Ubuntu. Everybody strives for inclusion in Ubuntu because it is by far the most popular distro.

http://qt-apps.org/

[Dorian]

OK, let's be honest - the 11 series of Ubuntu SUCKS. There are some very nice things about it, but it's all killed by a load of bullshit, starting with Unity that even after all the tweaks from 11.10 is plain ugly, stupid and cumbersome. I wanted to stick with Ubuntu even despite Unity, though. What killed it for me were the Wi-Fi issues (even the geeks from the Ubuntu forums don't know what's wrong). I've moved to Linux Mint and I have no Wi-Fi issues and the fonts look better than in Ubuntu even though I had mods that were supposed to fix the fonts.

I don't like the whole "Mint" aesthetics, but the system is solid while Ubuntu 11 is not so I just had to make the jump. Ubuntu devs went loco and if they don't get their shit together, Ubu is going to be a laughing stock.

[KiBa]

Too bad about the driver regressions on your hardware using 11.10. I don't care for Unity much either and am still a happy KDE user, the latest KDE 4.7 being the best interface I have ever used. But luckily for me, the 11.10 packages are the best this laptop has ever known. They really improved Intel video support.

I haven't had an issue with my wifi either. If you still want to give 11.10 another try (though I highly recommend Kubuntu), perhaps you could try installing 12.04 driver backports by installing Synaptic Package Manager and installing the wireless backports from there. Or try a PPA for your model wifi card to easily get the latest driver version.

Unity still has potential, but in general I do not like the fundamental conept, nor do I like Gnome 3 at all, so 11.10 is doubly uncomfortable to use, as Ubuntu now uses Unity and has been fully upgraded to Gnome 3. Gnome Shell (Gnome's Hell) is hardly better. Fortunately, the geniuses at KDE have long since surpassed the Gnome community anyhow, and KDE isn't going anywhere. So there will always be at least one excellent alternative.

Mint is okay, but I don't like the aesthetics either. However, it remains to be seen what will happen to the next Mint, as they too have upgraded to Gnome 3, and will thus have a different interface and underlying structure in a few weeks. So I still recommend KDE for the future. Now, if you can't run KDE, there is a new low-fat mode, and you can always just turn all the effects off to improve performance. There is also the XFCE and LXDE environments for low-end machines. However, I have a low-end machine, and KDE with full effects works beautifully. Like I said, the latest Intel video drivers are much improved.

[Dorian]

Yes, the Intel drivers are improved. I noticed it from the start. But I need my laptop mainly for smooth net surfing and Wi-Fi is what was killed with the newest Ubuntu. Backports and the latest driver for my Wi-Fi card didn't help. Plus I noticed that Ubuntu tends to go loco when you start to play with backports and Synaptic (especially now that it's not integrated with the system anymore).

The Wi-Fi issue is probably because of the shitty new kernel and I can't wait until somebody will generously fix it. I had to make the distro change. I'd use KDE if it wasn't for my crappy laptop being too slow for it and turning all the eye candies off would kill the very reason I like KDE. Besides, I don't like the general direction in which Ubuntu is going and Unity is a perfect example of how retarded the system has become.

[KiBa]

Yes, the new kernel has problems.

Here is a shiny new kernel for you to test, if you desire. It fixes some bugs. Maybe your wifi will be fixed. Who knows. Not me.

http://people.canonical.com/~ogasawara/lp844957/

As for your wifi woes, should the kernel do nothing, you should still keep it and use it, as it does fix some important bugs. But also tell me the make and model of your wireless card, and I will get you a working driver with installation instructions. Pay no attention to the obnoxious dolts on the Ubuntu forums. They try not to help people.

[Dorian]

I was already using that kernel, lol. Not only I had terrible Wi-Fi slowdows, but I also couldn't use VBA-M. The speed of VBA-M was below 50%. On Mint the Wi-Fi has no issues and VBA-M works at 95-105%. Maybe I'll check out 12.04, but the 11 series is doomed as far as I'm concerned.