Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full attention

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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Switch » Wed Sep 07, 2016 9:17 pm

Puffin_Chronic wrote:I have no idea what that meant;)

I remember Rakim translated that quote by the president of Sega, since the Google translation starts to lose the plot towards the end. Here it is:
It Appears SCE is backing up the development of Shenmue 3. Shenmue is a Sega IP, are there any plans to support this effort?

Shenmue is of course an important IP, not only to Sega, but also to the many games it has influenced. It was the first of its kind in the go anywhere, do anything open world style games. On top of that Mr. Suzuki had a very strong desire to make Shenmue 3. Craftsmanship is something that should be done by those who really want to create, and this has Yu Suzuki as the main developer. Of course Sega is interacting with Mr. Suzuki even now. We will continue supporting him concerning Shenmue 3 as well.
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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Let's Get Sweaty » Thu Sep 08, 2016 12:59 am

Puffin_Chronic wrote:Also from said article quoting the Euro marketing director when asked about the kickstarter-

"But their pleas were repeatedly ignored until earlier this year when its original developer Yu Suzuki unexpectedly announced a $2m kickstarter campaign in order to get Shenmue 3 finally made after Sega handed him over the license. The hugely popular campaign ultimately raised over $6m and became the sixth most funded campaign in the crowdfunding website’s history.”

“Yes, we want to innovate and back smartphones and virtual reality but our key purpose is to go back to what the brand used to stand for and I think the buzz around Shenmue 3 shows that people love our legacy,” adds Rooke, who says Sega is currently “exploring ways” to re-release the original two Shenmue titles."


That was a year ago. Same shit. No greenlight. "We are exploring ways", blah blah blah Sega.

They are always exploring ways to not do shit. Thats what Sega has done and will continue to (not?) do. Its like they have a script of talking points they need to feed the media when asked about Shenmue.


Just to provide full context, here's what the author of that article said when asked to clarify his paraphrasing on the Shenmue HD issue:

When I asked about Shenmue being remade, I was told "There are lots of opportunities for legacy titles. We are exploring. We know what fans want as they have a petition."


So whether the guy from Sega was referring to Shenmue specifically in his reply is, strictly speaking, debatable.
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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Monkei » Thu Sep 08, 2016 4:03 am

There's clearly stuff going on behind the scenes we don't know jack about. So what if Sega is "exploring ways" for quite a while now? I'd like to remember you guys once again of Yu Suzuki "looking into" Kickstarter. How long was that? Years? It's obviously not as easy as we'd like it to be.
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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Puffin_Chronic » Thu Sep 08, 2016 11:15 am

Monkei wrote: There's clearly stuff going on behind the scenes we don't know jack about. So what if Sega is "exploring ways" for quite a while now? I'd like to remember you guys once again of Yu Suzuki "looking into" Kickstarter. How long was that? Years? It's obviously not as easy as we'd like it to be.


Everything Yu has said I've believed and trust he speaks the truth. He has never lied to fans. And when he talked of kickstarter the whole thing materialized rather quickly.

You can't compare what he said to the words of Sega. 15 years of leading people on. I'm not going to keep debating it, but the bottom line is you can't take anything Sega says at face value. They have proven that, and their track record speaks for itself.
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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Giorgio » Thu Sep 08, 2016 11:20 am

SEGA prepares a lot of old games to be released on new platforms, and they use Shenmue as their flagship. That's because it's the most popular of them all, and also because it's a thorn-like title for their public image, as they have taken so much sh*t over the years from consumers.

By saving Shenmue in HD, they will also rectify that part of their image, which is damaged. Not only among Shenmue appreciators, but also within the whole SEGA community of idolaters :lol:. It would be great PR [that's the key-idea] for commemorating their old legacy through Shenmue's case. That's why we hear words from higher ups, like COOcoo's.

Additionally, it is also the greatest time to recapitalize on the Shenmue IP (and their whole legacy), following Shenmue III's Kickstarter Guinness-record-breaking success and the whole hype around. Both Shenmue III and the perceived HD editions will increase their profit, be it with merchandising etc.

As a faceless business, they don't really care about Shenmue III's success, but (as they said) they want to do the best conversion possible, in order to boost their public perception as much as possible; a rectification for old "sins" with poor ports of games.
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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby KiBa » Thu Sep 08, 2016 5:23 pm

That'll do, Sega. That'll do.
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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Monkei » Fri Sep 09, 2016 8:06 am

Puffin_Chronic wrote:
Monkei wrote: There's clearly stuff going on behind the scenes we don't know jack about. So what if Sega is "exploring ways" for quite a while now? I'd like to remember you guys once again of Yu Suzuki "looking into" Kickstarter. How long was that? Years? It's obviously not as easy as we'd like it to be.


Everything Yu has said I've believed and trust he speaks the truth. He has never lied to fans. And when he talked of kickstarter the whole thing materialized rather quickly.


Eh, not really that quickly.

On March 2, 2011, Suzuki spoke at the Game Developers Conference and said about Shenmue III: "I think Sega will let me make it ... it's a matter of budget …we have to make it in an affordable way."[22] On January 4, 2012, he suggested that Sega could license Shenmue to his company Ys Net to develop the game independently.[23]

In March 2013, news arose that Suzuki was considering crowdfunding or console exclusivity to fund Shenmue III.[24] During a presentation on the franchise at the 2014 Game Developers Conference, Suzuki said he would like to make Shenmue III with the "right opportunity", and in an interview the following day said he was researching the crowdfunding platform Kickstarter.[25]


Yes, apparently Kickstarter wasn't mentioned in name until 2014, but crowdfunding was already mentioned in early 2013. And apparently Suzuki was already trying to get things off the ground as early as 2011. He's not a company of course, but still, there's obviously stuff happening that takes its time. SEGA started its course correction last summer, at least they didn't talk about it publicly prior to that. That's when the SEGA Japan president admitted SEGA had betrayed its fans and promised they'd improve. That wasn't much more than a year ago. Might be for various reasons that we don't really know jack about.. legal stuff, negotiations, building a strategy, getting things in order for some kind of "SEGA is now cool again" campaign.. after Man of Steel came out it took Warner Bros. three years to launch the rest of their DCEU. We just don't know.

I don't think we have much to worry about, if anything at all. It's in Yu Suzuki's, SEGA's and Sony's interest to get the remasters out. The Shenmue franchise has never been in a better position (post Shenmue II) than now, things are looking bright as hell. Who really cares if it takes a little longer? I don't think it'll do any harm, even if the remasters come out after Shenmue III. They're polarizing games anyway and might get as many new people interested in the series as they might scare people (who would otherwise have been interested in Shenmue III) away by having aged badly and, well, being a love/hate thing to begin with.

I guess what I'm trying to say is chill out. Things are looking bright. SEGA apparently trying to get it done is good enough for me, it'll all work out in the end.

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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Let's Get Sweaty » Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:14 am

Monkei wrote:I guess what I'm trying to say is chill out. Things are looking bright. SEGA apparently trying to get it done is good enough for me, it'll all work out in the end.


It's good enough for you and that's great, but other people can decide for themselves what's good enough for them.

All any of us are doing at this stage is interpreting signs, with none of us knowing for sure what Sega's doing or the strength of their convictions.

You may be confident that they're doing everything they can, and no one can tell you you're wrong. But anyone who feels a responsibility to keep the pressure on Sega now more than ever is equally entitled to do so, as that feeling may later haunt them if they do nothing and Sega does the same.

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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Kintor » Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:43 am

Let's Get Sweaty wrote: It's good enough for you and that's great, but other people can decide for themselves what's good enough for them.

All any of us are doing at this stage is interpreting signs, with none of us knowing for sure what Sega's doing or the strength of their convictions.

You may be confident that they're doing everything they can, and no one can tell you you're wrong. But anyone who feels a responsibility to keep the pressure on Sega now more than ever is equally entitled to do so, as that feeling may later haunt them if they do nothing and Sega does the same.

I get that you want to do something to help Shenmue any way that you can. I mean, sitting idly by just isn't in the nature of the Sega fanbase. The fact that a dedicated Shenmue community still exists, a full 15 years since the release of Shenmue 2 and the discontinuation of the Dreamcast, is a testament to just how passionate the Sega fanbase remains to this day. Even so, there are still times when Sega fans can get worked-up over nothing, in the absence of any concrete news. Personally I think that things are going quite well, Shenmue 3 is in development and Sega is openly talking about HD ports of the previous. It's only a matter of time before we have Shenmue 1 and 2 HD.

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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Let's Get Sweaty » Fri Sep 09, 2016 10:16 am

Kintor wrote:Even so, there are still times when Sega fans can get worked-up over nothing, in the absence of any concrete news.


Of course.

What it comes down to, then, is whether you prefer to err on the side of caution or complacency.

If Sega's got everything in hand and the remakes/remasters are as much of a sure thing as you unequivocally state they are, then the biggest regret anyone's going to feel is, "Damn, I wish I'd stopped worrying a little sooner. Those lost minutes on Twitter are never coming back."

On the other hand, if Sega starts finding their investigations too difficult or costly, and decides to let the matter quietly drop because the heat's died down, then the biggest regret will be having Shenmue HD within our grasp and letting it slip through our fingers

You may be 100% certain that's not going to happen, and so you can sit back and relax. There's no evidence that proves you shouldn't, so again, I'm not going to tell you you're wrong.

All I would ask is that if you feel that way, then let others do as they may. They're doing you no harm, and it just might be their efforts that end up fulfilling your prophecy.
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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Kintor » Fri Sep 09, 2016 11:49 am

Let's Get Sweaty wrote: Of course.

What it comes down to, then, is whether you prefer to err on the side of caution or complacency.

If Sega's got everything in hand and the remakes/remasters are as much of a sure thing as you unequivocally state they are, then the biggest regret anyone's going to feel is, "Damn, I wish I'd stopped worrying a little sooner. Those lost minutes on Twitter are never coming back."

On the other hand, if Sega starts finding their investigations too difficult or costly, and decides to let the matter quietly drop because the heat's died down, then the biggest regret will be having Shenmue HD within our grasp and letting it slip through our fingers

You may be 100% certain that's not going to happen, and so you can sit back and relax. There's no evidence that proves you shouldn't, so again, I'm not going to tell you you're wrong.

All I would ask is that if you feel that way, then let others do as they may. They're doing you no harm, and it just might be their efforts that end up fulfilling your prophecy.

I assure you that I'm not being complacent, right now I'm just devoting my energy towards other matters. There's always something going across the Sega fanbase, even if particular situations temporarily become intractable.

For example, right now I'm keenly interested in VR technology and what that might mean for the internet at large. There may come a time soon when the whole World Wide Web (and it's forums) is rendered obsolete, to be replaced by immersive virtual communities, like a cross between an MMORPG and a social media platform. When that day comes, what happens to the Sega fanbase? How do we survive and thrive as a group in that new era? But I digress...

The important thing right now is that I don't think there is anything more that can reasonably done in regards to getting Shenmue 1 and 2 HD made. Sega has always offered every assurance that they're working on the project, even if they aren't ready to make an official announcement. Expecting anything further at this point is just going to result in another round of recriminations with the Sega fanbase. Which would be shame, I think that we're better than that.
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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Let's Get Sweaty » Fri Sep 09, 2016 12:26 pm

I haven't asked you to justify why you're not pushing. Again, what you're prepared to do, or see the point in doing, is your own business. I only ask that people don't actively discourage others who do feel the need. If you don't share their feeling, that's fine. Nobody says you have to.

As far as "recriminations with the Sega fan base" go - honestly, what? As long as Shenmue fans aren't spamming up unrelated threads and spoiling them for other gamers, which I've never condoned, then other Sega fans have nothing to complain about. Any who think they do are frankly not my top priority.
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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Kintor » Fri Sep 09, 2016 10:20 pm

Let's Get Sweaty wrote: I haven't asked you to justify why you're not pushing. Again, what you're prepared to do, or see the point in doing, is your own business. I only ask that people don't actively discourage others who do feel the need. If you don't share their feeling, that's fine. Nobody says you have to.

As far as "recriminations with the Sega fan base" go - honestly, what? As long as Shenmue fans aren't spamming up unrelated threads and spoiling them for other gamers, which I've never condoned, then other Sega fans have nothing to complain about. Any who think they do are frankly not my top priority.

You're never going to get a free pass when it comes to Shenmue 1 and 2 HD; least of all here, where as this thread shows, many people are quite happy with progress that is being made. Because the truth of the matter is that your opinion can't exist in a vacuum. You want to make a lot of noise so that Sega can hear you, the trouble is that everyone else can hear you at the same time and we may not all agree with the assertions you're making in regards to the situation. The message Sega gave in that magazine interview is harmless, just a nod to the Sega fanbase that Shenmue 1 and 2 HD is still on the way. Any hand-wringing on your part over a week later is just a waste of energy.
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Re: Sega Europe: Shenmue 1 and 2 remakes have our full atten

Postby Anonymous81 » Tue Sep 13, 2016 4:39 am

It's better news than nothing at all. There are two possible scenarios here. A fully featured "remaster," or an upscaled port with minimal enhancements other than the work of porting it to different hardware with different instruction sets and rendering technology etc.

If it's the latter, then they need cheap licensing since they clearly don't want to spend a ton on a pair of games that, admittedly, probably have a fairly niche audience no matter how much we may all love them. And which might get fairly to poorly reviewed today. So if they need cheap licensing, and don't want to do the work of replacing the licensed stuff with generic alternatives... the license situation really can be thorny potentially.

Saporro, Hitachi, Glenfiddich, Timex, and Coca-Cola would all have to agree and in a way that's worth any potential cost to SEGA. It's unlikely SEGA has had any relationships with those brands since Shenmue II, and any that decline have to be replaced by generic alternatives. Which means actual asset creation for a game that is 15 years old, that's already being ported to hardware that is 15 years newer. Not a ton of work compared to developing a game from scratch, but still significant work. Plus QA. Naturally SEGA wants to limit the amount they need to do for this, but I'm sure they also want it to at least be considered minimally acceptable by the standards of modern HD re-releases.

If they do a proper remaster with new textures, UI, etc. then it goes without saying they're willing to spend some money on it, in which case it will happen well after Shenmue III comes out (if it hits its release window, which I'm prepared for it not to) but the license issues shouldn't be a problem either in that case, since they're already plunking down some funds for the project in that scenario.

The problem is, either of those scenarios could be perfectly in line with these statements from SEGA. The licensing is an issue if they don't want to do much work on it... and they could be an issue for legal or negotiation reasons even if they're willing to pay.

Either way, at least they know what we want. That's something.
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