Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

(Shenmue I & II Re-Release Discussion)

Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby Sappharad » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:29 pm

GYO6161 wrote: I knew compressed audio was what we were getting. While it's known Sega still has Ryo's English lines uncompressed i highly doubt they also have every single uncompressed line from the close to one a thousand NPCs throughout both games in both languages so its understandable.

Based on the quality in the reveal trailer, I agree, it seemed likely. But I suspect that they probably still have all of the audio assets, everything. At that point data storage was already pretty cheap so why destroy them? The audio in the final game is also in different frequencies already. Don't quote me on this because it's from memory and I didn't re-verify, but the FREE audio (non-cutscene) in Shenmue 2 is 8khz, while the cutscene voices are all 11khz.

If it were me, and I'm not them, I would've probably kept two things so that I wouldn't need duplicates:
1. The original master dailies
2. The final build assets

The final build assets would already be downsampled and compressed, so that's no good if you want to improve them. But the original master dailies, the raw recordings from each day in the studio, would be long continuous recordings of lines. If that's what they still have, they'd have to split apart every single line again and match them up with the original clips. That's a lot of work. Audio matching and splicing is a process that can be partially automated, (think along the lines of how Shazam can detect audio) but someone still needs to manually review everything because you can't be perfect when you're not comparing identical things. Then you still have to assemble the new assets into AHX containers.

With what we learned today, these new ports are consistent with Sega's other Dreamcast-era ports like Crazy Taxi & Sonic Adventure 2.
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby staplepuffs27 » Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:23 am

Valascaziel wrote: He did a nice job explaining that the assets just weren't there for the cutscene ratio. I don't think it'll be that jarring to be honest.

I had no idea the original game was so intensive and complicated in coding. It sounds like it was a miracle to port it at all...

It still astounds me that after years upon years of pleading, nearly $7 million invested in a sequel they have no involvement with that SEGA would be so afraid a re-release would not yield them a return from passionate fans.

I really, really hope this wakes them up and a proper in-house Shenmue IV comes alive for PS5(let's face it, that's where it'll end up if it comes).
So, does anyone else play Xbox One backwards compatible games? With a couple exceptions, like Ninja Gaiden, there's no widescreen support. I've been playing Knights of the Old Republic, and honestly, I didn't even notice the aspect ratio after the first 10 minutes. And Shenmue will have widescreen gameplay. So, I really don't think it'll be a big deal.

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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby spud1897 » Wed Jul 04, 2018 3:03 am

Cannot wait for August 21st. Any word on what the new controls are like? I know Adam had a go with them but can't remember if he passed comment on them?
One day we will have our revenge.
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby PILMAN » Wed Jul 04, 2018 3:10 am

I was reading the steam forums and apparently there are some concerns about the DRM being used that it requires an always online connection, anyone know anything else about this?
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby Hazuki00 » Wed Jul 04, 2018 3:48 am

Loading times have been improved! Good, one of my few complaints when I was playing the games in Dreamcast was the loading time when you enter in shops or buildins. It was a bit boring if you enter in a few shops in a row, it took many seconds and slowed a lot the pace of the game.

In my opinion, these remasters are good enough. They could be beeter? Yes, but we are getting more than we expected few years (or months) ago.
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby Tosh » Wed Jul 04, 2018 4:58 am

PILMAN wrote: I was reading the steam forums and apparently there are some concerns about the DRM being used that it requires an always online connection, anyone know anything else about this?



it will use Denuvo, you can see that information on the steam store page.
its a software that tries to protect the copy protection function of Steam, Origin, Uplay and so on.
so its like a protection for the protection.

as far as i know, its not really clear how it works but there is a lot of bad whispering
that the software slows down your computer.
it gets a little unclear here because there are cases where Denuvo is 100% responsible
for performance problems and there are cases
where people thought that the problem was Denuvo but in the end it wasnt.

so there are a lot of rumors with a lot of unproven allegations. (on the list of pros and cons)
Denuvo locks the EXE file of the game, so you cant modify it at all.

the always online thing is also a bit unclear - there are Denuvo games
where the software needs to connect to a server like every 2 weeks to verify your game library
and it also need to connect to a server if you upgrade your video card driver or your hardware.

otherwise you cant start the game anymore.
but there are also Denuvo games that you only have to activate one time and thats it.
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby Spaghetti » Wed Jul 04, 2018 5:56 am

People like to scream that Denuvo is always online, but it's really not. I've been able to get into Denuvo-using games in offline mode fine, I just don't think you can do that indefinitely, however. Unless you actively decide to go off the grid, have the worst internet imaginable, or are on deployment in the military or whatever... you're unlikely to ever be inconvenienced by Denuvo having to check-in with an internet connection occasionally.

Harder DRM (Denuvo) on top of softer DRM (Steam) is a bit silly, but people work themselves into contortions over Denuvo as a bogeyman. First it allegedly destroyed SSDs (disproved since), now it causes performance issues (I believe tests have shown it hampers performance by... a few frames at best?).

There's a hilarious case on the Steam forums right now, with someone whining in every thread about how Denuvo is SEGA treating paying customers like pirates. Some brave soul raked over that user's posting history and found... admissions of piracy.

A lot of Denuvo whining is projection, and propaganda.

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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby shenhaZ » Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:06 am

What about brands? (timex, cola, etc)
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby Spaghetti » Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:24 am

shenhaZ wrote: What about brands? (timex, cola, etc)

A Bellwoods cola machine can be seen in the background, so brands are likely gone entirely.
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby Anonymous81 » Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:52 am

Spaghetti wrote: People like to scream that Denuvo is always online, but it's really not. I've been able to get into Denuvo-using games in offline mode fine, I just don't think you can do that indefinitely, however. Unless you actively decide to go off the grid, have the worst internet imaginable, or are on deployment in the military or whatever... you're unlikely to ever be inconvenienced by Denuvo having to check-in with an internet connection occasionally.

Harder DRM (Denuvo) on top of softer DRM (Steam) is a bit silly, but people work themselves into contortions over Denuvo as a bogeyman. First it allegedly destroyed SSDs (disproved since), now it causes performance issues (I believe tests have shown it hampers performance by... a few frames at best?).

There's a hilarious case on the Steam forums right now, with someone whining in every thread about how Denuvo is SEGA treating paying customers like pirates. Some brave soul raked over that user's posting history and found... admissions of piracy.

A lot of Denuvo whining is projection, and propaganda.


This x 1000. Likewise, I keep seeing people say things like, "Remove Denuvo... or I'll just keep playing my pirated copy in an emulator." Lol. Like... people do know the fact that there's a thriving piracy scene (those who have legitimate backups excepted, of course, so long as they aren't distributing them to others or downloading them) is WHY publishers include these anti-tamper measures, right? I keep trying to tell this to people, but they continue to insist they are entitled to the software anyway. And as long as they do so, companies will continue to crack down on them, and with them, paying customers. I don't like intrusive DRM either, and as a rule, avoid buying games with it. But the solution in this case is not to NOT support a game that's been out of print for decades, and keep pirating it lol. That will just make the case to Sega that they need better and more DRM, not less. Piracy hurts gamers. It's one thing to take a principled stand and not buy something (though for Shenmue obviously I make a huge exception,) it's another thing entirely to steal it.
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby DigitalDuck » Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:16 am

Anonymous81 wrote:This x 1000. Likewise, I keep seeing people say things like, "Remove Denuvo... or I'll just keep playing my pirated copy in an emulator." Lol. Like... people do know the fact that there's a thriving piracy scene (those who have legitimate backups excepted, of course, so long as they aren't distributing them to others or downloading them) is WHY publishers include these anti-tamper measures, right? I keep trying to tell this to people, but they continue to insist they are entitled to the software anyway. And as long as they do so, companies will continue to crack down on them, and with them, paying customers. I don't like intrusive DRM either, and as a rule, avoid buying games with it. But the solution in this case is not to NOT support a game that's been out of print for decades, and keep pirating it lol. That will just make the case to Sega that they need better and more DRM, not less. Piracy hurts gamers. It's one thing to take a principled stand and not buy something (though for Shenmue obviously I make a huge exception,) it's another thing entirely to steal it.


Denuvo adds a massive overhead, which hurts those without supercomputers. Pirates crack Denuvo easily (Sonic Mania was cracked in less than a week), and then they get a version without the massive overhead (and since it runs better on their computers and never needs to be online, it's a better version too).

Intrusive DRM doesn't prevent piracy; it encourages it.
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby Anonymous81 » Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:24 am

The performance impact of Denuvo is debatable, and some facets of the claims surrounding it have been thoroughly debunked. Others remain possible, though (however, results from crackers and pirates are not results I will respect or trust personally.)

I didn't say I support the inclusion of Denuvo or other intrusive DRM for the record. On the contrary, as a general rule, I oppose it, and as I stated, I generally won't buy games that include it (though I'm making a massive exception for Shenmue, because it's a game I adore and has been out of print for nearly two decades and supporting it will help preserve the game,) or if I do, I wait for massive discounts.

But the issue isn't whether Denuvo reduces piracy. The issue is whether piracy makes Denuvo and its ilk more likely, which it does. The more people pirate - and I want to state this as unequivocally as I can: people have ZERO moral or legal right to pirate, period, and I will oppose piracy, full stop - the more likely these DRM measures become. I don't agree with it, but that's the reality. If you want to stop anti-piracy measures... you can't solely oppose their inclusion. You also have to oppose piracy.

I oppose both. That's where I stand. Won't debate it beyond that. Agree to disagree if need be.
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby DigitalDuck » Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:41 am

Anonymous81 wrote:But the issue isn't whether Denuvo reduces piracy. The issue is whether piracy makes Denuvo and its ilk more likely, which it does. The more people pirate - and I want to state this as unequivocally as I can: people have ZERO moral or legal right to pirate, period, and I will oppose piracy, full stop - the more likely these DRM measures become. I don't agree with it, but that's the reality. If you want to stop anti-piracy measures... you can't solely oppose their inclusion. You also have to oppose piracy.


Then we have a problem. The more intrusive DRM measures become, the more likely it is to be pirated. Piracy causes DRM, and DRM causes piracy. We have a vicious cycle here, and escalating the cycle is bad for businesses because their increasing anti-consumer practices in trying to prevent piracy results in fewer consumers and more pirates; as such, the onus is on businesses to break this cycle or else lose money.

I don't support people downloading a cracked copy of a game they haven't paid for. People worked hard to bring you this, reward them. Doing otherwise is both immoral and illegal.

However, I fully support people making improvements to the game they paid for by cracking it or downloading cracked copies of it - you've already paid for all of the copyrighted code and content within the file you're downloading, someone else has just provided their own free software that makes it better. And people have every moral or legal right to do this.
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby Anonymous81 » Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:51 am

They absolutely, factually (not a matter of opinion) do NOT have a legal right to do so. It's a myth that you have the legal right to download a copy of a game you own. You do have a legal entitlement to CREATE your own backup copy of software you've purchased. You do NOT have the legal entitlement to download someone else's, or to distribute your own, online. That is called piracy, and is illegal. You can argue the moral right. You cannot argue the legal right. As stated though, I won't debate it beyond this point. We'll have to agree to disagree.
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Re: Adam Koralik explains the re-releases (4:3, audio etc)

Postby Valascaziel » Wed Jul 04, 2018 9:23 am

The important thing to remember is the ingenuity of the PC community. They have a dedication not seen on the closed sources of consoles.

What I mean by that is--everything you see that mayhaps someone has an issue with can be changed with some TLC modding.

Changing cutscene aspect ratio, using passport models in the entirety of the game, improving weather effects, modding back in the licensed products(maybe on this one), etc. Hell, maybe even the most dedicated of programmers or modders could find a way to activate 60FPS without breaking the game.

There is always that one talented fan who can just go in and revamp things like that. Look at http://www.re4hd.com for an example of how dedication and raw talent can improve something beyond its release with mods.

A long time ago, some guys were working on an impressive fan remaster of Resident Evil 2. It got C&D'd, but I believe Capcom hired them I'd I'm not mistaken.
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